The Zim Family Cocker Spaniel Forum

I am thinking that the time is drawing near for us to say goodbye to Sadie. With all of my heart and soul, I have never thought about this before but lately -- with all of the dental issues and now the refusal of eating just about anything/everything -- I am thinking that her quality of life is pretty poor and the stress on all of us is really getting pretty difficult. But how do you know ??? Her medical outcome is relatively stable/OK. When she's out and about, she's fine and quite sociable. And when I'm home, she's perfectly fine and VERY happy. But when I need to go to work or to leave the house, she is just miserable and totally refuses to eat and is having accidents (major ones even through the doggie-diaper) while in her crate or while in the house with one of my kids supervising her. ?? She has lost quite a bit of weight since the dental procedures in November but we are able to maintain her current weight by "force feeding" her -- three times a day with a syringe using the maximum-calorie canned dog food, Royal Canin's A/D (aka "Doggie Ensure"). She takes it OK and has maintained her low weight (13.8 lbs.) for several weeks now. She used to weigh 16.8 lbs. back in October/November. She is just so very thin and her spine and ribs are beginning to protrude. This is breaking my heart.

How do I know? How best can I tell? I just spoke with our vet and he told me that he runs on "quality of life" and whenever I need to talk or when we feel the need is there, it's OK.

Sadie is 15 years old now. But without a medical diagnosis of some sort of problem, how can I agree to this?

Any recommendations, guidance, or support on this topic is really appreciated. She is my heart dog. My true heart dog.

I'm so sorry you are going through this. It is a terrible thing to have to decide for someone else. I try to ask myself if I would want to live in that situation. I have a boxer that is showing his age and I know the day will come when I have to make the same decision for him. It's never easy, but I think you will know when it is the right time.

I am so sorry.

Last Oct, we made that decision for our 14 yr old boy, as I have had to do in the past.
His quality of life went downhill quickly. He was deaf, almost blind, bad hips, and finally seizures. When he had the Grand Mals, he lost bladder control, and perhaps that is what those major accidents are that you see.
At first we didn't realize what had happened.
After the last one, which happened in front of us, Ryan was disoriented and dazed. We took him to the vet who asked us how long we planned to let this go on.
We decided then that he was telling us it was time.
Two yrs ago, my beloved 17 yr old kitty told me it was time.
In your heart YOU WILL KNOW.

Patti

I remember saying to another forum member that asked the same question, when our "merry" dog is no longer merry, it's time. It is truly -for me - based on quality of life. My feeling was always if they aren't in pain and able to still enjoy more than half of what they're used to, I will clean up after, cook special meals and do whatever I need to do. When they are no longer able to enjoy at least half, then I need to look carefully at what I am doing. I also believe in your heart you will know the right time. You will look at her, she will look at you and you will hear her voice in your heart.

Quality of life was once defined by a vet (in my town) as when your pet no longer enjoys or wants to do its three favorite things (eat, play, walk, etc.), then, in the dog's eyes, it no longer has a quality of life. But, just because it is old and no longer wants to do those things, it doesn't mean it is time to kick them to the curb, there is usually a health crisis that brings you to the decision.

Is it possible that Sadie is having some separation anxiety when you leave and therefore not eating and having bathroom problems? I'm sorry but I missed what dental issues she had.

If you trust your vet, I would ask them to guide you on whether it is time to let her go. In the end it will be your decision.

Most of us have had to deal with the inconvenience of dealing with an older dog, but that is what you do for love and family. It is heartbreaking for all. Like the others have said, "you will know" when it is time to let go. You can see it in her eyes.

I'm so sorry that you are having to face this with your dog. It was the hardest thing I ever had to do.

Thank you all for your thoughts that will help guide me.

In all honesty, I am seeing it in her eyes now. I really truly am. She no longer wants to move, play, be merry -- or do anything any longer. We are carrying her around the house more often than not and she is awake but looking like she has senile dementia and is quite confused. Her dental issues (severe gum disease, decaying teeth (5 of them surgically removed) and post-operative infections) have made eating even more difficult but she basically gave up on all dog food approximately two years ago. However, when I cooked dinner for the family, it was Sadie who was always there for her bowl full. That Sadie is now gone.

I just haven't given up as yet. Last week, I urged our vet to start Sadie on a small dose of Mirtazapine, an appetite stimulant. I am not really seeing any changes as yet but perhaps it needs more time. She is still choosing not to eat anything that we have available -- even my home cooked meals (which used to be her #1 favorite thing to eat). But, I am noticing that she is walking around the kitchen more and hanging in the next room (dining room/living room) while we are having our nightly family dinner. Over the past couple of weeks, she had been taking herself back upstairs to her bed as she wanted no part of any food or family.

However, she does still sit by the front window waiting for me to return home. This is what I see each time I get in front of the house. That's my Sadie-dog.

I haven't been through this yet but I know it is never easy. I am thinking of you and your sweet girl.

If it were me, I would take her off the mirtazapine and see if that makes a difference. It IS an appetite stimulant, but it can also be a very disorienting, sedating drug and it may be making her feel worse more than it is helping. I agree with what others have said, you will know when it is the right time. Both my girls let me know. Mocha lost the use of her hind legs and began having labored breathing all in a matter of minutes. She had been battling lymphoma for nearly 2 years, and I knew I had to let her go. Her eyes were no longer smiling... through chemo treatments, vet visits, all of it, she was always happy. At 10pm one night her eyes were smiling, by 1am, they were definately not. She was still eating, but it was time. With Poppy, she was still happy, but having uncontrollable seizures, dangerously high blood pressure, and so much neurological damage she couldn't see or walk. She went from healthy to that condition in less than 24 hours and there was no chance of improvement. I just couldn't let her suffer. Sending lots of hugs your way!

Oh, Michele, your last post made me cry. I can see how difficult this is for you. Yes, it does sound like she is preparing for her trip over the bridge. I am so sorry for you and your whole family. Obviously this will create a hole in your "pack" and heart. I wish you all the best.

I lost my Gable (Newfoundland/Border Collie) to mouth cancer almost a year ago. Even though he was a large dog (over 100 lbs) he was in excellent health for a 14 year old dog and very active and loved life. Then the cancer set in and within 4 months he was gone. Other than his mouth, he wasn't ill, but it was taking it's toll on him and me, too. Because of where the tumor was in his mouth, his incisor had ruptured it and we were constantly battling infection and blood loss from the tumor. I know it sounds silly, but my moment of understanding came when I was giving him his medications one day. He had a hard time taking and then swolliwing the pastrami that I used as a "chaser" for the pills. His tumor was outgrowing his mouth....it was at that moment that I realized it was time. I had thought that we still had weeks or more with him, but it just hit me like that. I think every experience is so individual to everyone.

I do have to say, though, to not doubt yourself or your little girl. You will know.

Take care. Hugs to you and your family.

It is sounding like she's about ready to say goodbye - but I haven't had to go through it yet. Henry seemed fairly healthy or at least not in any immediate danger, the morning I left him and came back at lunchtime to find him gone. I do know that I would give a lot to have been with him when he went, to hold him and tell him I loved him and that he was my once-in-a-lifetime dog, rather than have him die alone. So if you thinking that time is getting close, it might be better to ask your vet if he thinks it is time to let her go, in your arms with your voice, rather than risk finding her gone.

Change the name in your story from "Sadie" to "Cricket" and that was my story three years ago.

I think you already know.

I am so sorry you are going through this. How do you know? Big question. I recently lost Holly my heart dog of 13 years. I knew she was going downhill but stuck it as long as she was happy, was eating, was continent and acted oriented. I did not mind to have to carry her outside, stay up at night checking on her or have to change her diet and hand fed her if necessary or that she took so many pills due to so many medical issues and slow down so much that only walked inside the house. She started going downhill markedly since december with several ups and downs and bad reactions to meds. Her last week she stopped eating, got very shaky trembling, did not wanted her meds so i had to crushed them, her breathing got very heavy, she was still continent going to do her business outside but almost calculating each step, so I knew it was not fair for her. She looked happy on times but others her eyes will follow me and like to telling me its enough. The vet gave me some valium to calm her tremors and i knew it was time. Please talk to your vet regarding end of life protocol in his clinic. It helped that i mentally prepared myself weeks ahead and also how my vet proceed was the most peaceful and calm and just the way i wanted. My prayers are with you.

I also wanted to mention something else to consider when making this awful decision. Our first pup, my Coriander, was put to sleep in the vet's office. While the vet we had at that time was lovely and supportive, it was still at their office. When our Maxine's time and our Monkey cat's time came, the vet came to us. Maxine was able to leave us while laying on the deck in her favorite spot; the warm sun on her back, next to the fish pond waterfall she enjoyed listening to. Her puppy sister and brothers were their to say goodbye and I do think it also helped them understand she was gone. Monkey left us resting next to the fireplace with soft music and all "her" dogs with her. I know some people would find it difficult but we felt it made for a more gentle goodbye than getting them into the car, taking them to the vet and standing in office to say goodbye.

Well, an update which isn't too "up". I took Sadie off of the mirtazapine on Saturday morning and she has not improved at all. Her weight is slowly but surely dropping and after speaking to our vet in length and in great detail, he is very willing to do what we need to do whenever we want to do that. (sigh) He did offer an x-ray and/or an ultrasound to see if something is happening to her on the inside. I agreed to the x-ray which is being done right now. I will opt for the ultrasound if more info needs to be gathered depending on what the x-ray reveals.

Bottom line: I am now clearly seeing a 15-year old rescued and completely loved cocker spaniel have ZERO quality of life. We have had her for the past 13+ years and our decision-making needs to happen soon. What's strange is that I have seen and heard her barking to the sky over the past few days. Sadie has not barked for the past few months and this behavior leads me to believe that the angels are ready for her. (big sigh)

I will let you know what the vet sees from today's x-ray as soon as I hear from him. Thank you, everyone.

Please know we are all thinking of you.

You are in my thoughts and prayers. Very tough decision, but it will be out of love.

Michele, my thoughts are with you

Hugs and prayers for you . . . this part of owning a dog is NEVER easy

Thoughts and prayers! I haven't been old enough to have to make this decision! I can't imagine how hard it would be. I pray for everyone's comfort at this time! :-)

It's definitely something you will know, they seem to have a way of telling us when it's time. Having gone through this decision with Shiloh I know how hard it is, and my thoughts are with you.

Like Kelly said, this part is never easy. My heart breaks for you. Your decision along with your heartbreak comes through loud and clear. I wish you ease as you help your little one.

(((hugs))) and tears from Florida.

Oh how heartbreaking for you.
She seems to be talking to the others waiting at the Bridge.
I believe that, because when my mother was dying, she told me that she could see light and people at the end of it.

My cocker friends here just lost 2 of their cockers in the last 2 weeks.

Patti

We're now playing "Stump the Band". The x-ray showed absolutely nothing unusual or suspicious. Our vet was able to "easily" check her mouth and did not see anything problematic there either. The lack of fighting or holding back opening wide indicates a MAJOR problem to me but our vet thinks otherwise. ?? Our next step is blood work and we should know those results tomorrow morning. He gave her a shot of cerenia, the anti-nausea med that may be able to help with her appetite or possible motion sickness. ?? He also gave her a thorough exam and palpated every area of her body to see if he could find the source. Nadda. ?? Has she eaten since coming home? No. Any water consumption? No to that too. ??

So, until the lab results come back tomorrow, we'll have to wait it out a bit more. I'll see if she will eat a home-cooked meal tonight for dinner. I am still trying my best and praying BIG TIME.

Oh Patti, my mom, too, told me a couple weeks before she passed away that angels came to visit with her while she was in her hospital bed. I truly thought maybe she had dreamt this or was a possible medication side-effect (??) -- but she swore that it was during the day and as clear as can be. She also told me that they ALL looked like me (and that really spooked the @#$%^% out of me). That's why I am feeling that Sadie is ready. (sigh)

Michelle, if you have a syringe that you can take up fresh water and put it in the corner of her mouth to drink so that she doesn't get dehydrated.

This is a stumper. In the wild, a canine leaves the pack to go off and die alone because they just know.